In my opinion if two units in particular needs redesign is : Lich & Vampire.
Look at the overwhelming amount of hope and positivity you guys instilled in your fan base after the Haven and Academy reveal? The lineup and some unit designs are close to h6 but not copied pasted.
I think I can speak for most when I say we all appreciate more toned down, less flashy, less spikey art design. If you guys work to please your fan base you will find a dragon's utopia amount of gold being thrown at you.
No mention about Lamasu? I'm surprised.
Lich and Vampire are much more important than Lamasu. Ideally all 3 should be remodeled, but if only 2 then yea, Lich and Vampire please!
@dragoninnight - The thing about the lamasu... if people don't like it, they don't like it no matter how it looks. Lich and Vampires have been around for the long run with many different appearances and a lot of fans; if anything is to be refined, it's those two.
Lamasu is a new unit in the franchise, unlike Lich and Vampire which are classics.
So when they say "one or two", I won't ask for a third.
I would say Lich and Skeleton. The vampire is going to stay the same no matter what. Sure they might tone down the sword and fix that god-awful face but it won' change much. The Lich is horrible. The upgraded skeleton makes NO SENSE in my opinion it looks like it has better weapons and armor than the vampire which is just absurd for a skeleton.
Lamasu isn't much of a problem. It needs better colors and some fine tuning proportion wise but overall it wasn't bad. With better stats and abilities it could work.
Liches need some serious redesign and vampires some visual alterations.
@Raenus : Core tier didn't receive same amount of hate than Elite one.
Fair enough. The skeleton still pisses me off though.
@Raenus : You're a dwarf. You gotta be pissed of at something anyway. :P
thank you devs i thought we were hopless by now!,
exactly agreed with galaad here! please work on first lich, then vampire, İIF YOU STILL GOT TIME then lamasu.
but please fix the lich first.
by the way personally i support your lamasu creature idea, an undead-beast concept, but h6 one was looking much better than h7 one presented to us. it need some nice textures to feel acctually real.
thank you, good work guys!
please next time share stuff in earlier so we can also give feedback earlier.
lamassu and lich, all 3 units will be present in the lineup so it is important to have the best looking- and lamassu is the ugliest, lich has great potential to be changed (and needs it more than vampire)
Even if they change the model for Lich, it will still be skeletal. I say : rework the Lamasu instead
@Cleglaw: I agree with you all.
Lamasu in H6 is indeed better, but as a fan of Lamasu, I'm so happy to see they're come back despite the huge amount of haters so I don't care much how they look.
Most people is agree with you, I think. I would have prefer other beats instead of a Lamasu but, if we are going to have only minor changes, then, it would be perfect to have new Liches and new Vampires.
Just to be fair- Academy reuses designs prepared for MM: Heroes 6 (and probably some animations are also from that game).
Haven- some units, like pretorians and crossbowmen, have a bit similar design and animation (specially pretorian).
But lich and vampire, fans- favuorites, using their exactly same models (a bit redesigned, and in case of vampire- for a lot worse)- that is simply a sin!
i can only upvote such a comment, i'm glad you calmed down :-) youre comments are nicer to read that way ;-)
Oke i will admit that maybe if i play with the necro's i could like the spiders. But i still feel that they should be neutral. And about Lamasu, i never liked them ingame, i never cared for its design. But the Lamasu was way too weak for a elite.
Don't forget the spider. I know it's a long shoot, but I think it should be gone, and replaced with another creature. Mummy, Zombie, Ghoul for exemple
Redesigning (at least) the Lich & the Vampire is a must in my book.
Should the developers find time and resources, the Lamassu would also benefit from a facelift. Something along these lines: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-95aTks2FLT4/ThXBpIWPLjI/AAAAAAAAAZI/SMv4zosyfaI/s1600/lamasu1a.jpg
I believe this is an older concept, known to wider HOMM community.
I agree with you, but still need to remove unnecessary frilly details and improvements of the skeleton.
Yes, make Vampiress and Lich Queen, bald with spider tattoo on her forehead
For Vampire look i would prefer:
1) Darker colours
2) Adding red cloak
3) smaller more elegant sword
4) less spikes for upgraded version
2) This picture from heroes forum perfectly fits what most of us are expecting for liches to look like, also there are just some minor changes
The spider remains, it is a joke. The Necropolis lineup with blighted by its existence. Undead armies dont need spiders. I cant believe they are allowing it to stay.
Yes I aggree that some of the unit design art was not the best, but those images are not labelled work in progress for nothing, they are just so we know what units make up the line ups. The final artwork wont be seen until the final releases
I agree. It's been a great deal of time, in-universe, from Heroes VI to VII.
I really liked the proto-liches as they were in VI. The first, almost failed experiments with life-extending magic. But after so many years they should have got it down to something more permanent closer to the classic skeletal aesthetic.
As for the Vampires: Stop with the huge weapons. It should be simple. It is larger than the Landsknecht's zweihander, and that's ridiculous.
I can get that they're trying to convey that the Vampires are stronger than they look. But huge impractical swords are only impressive to Otakus. We'd be much more interested in a vampire armed with a weapon a HEMA practitioner would actually consider bringing into battle, instead of laughing himself into the ground.
The Landsknecht if fine, they're big guys with big swords, and you got a perfectly balanced sword for the Guardians. But I feel the Vampires would be better serviced with rapiers.
thank you devs i thought we were hopeless by now!
please work on first lich, then vampire, and IF YOU STILL GOT TIME then lamasu.
but please fix the lich first. skeletal as much as possible with calm-self confident charishma ...with better mage like staff and a spellbook if its ok.
by the way personally i support your lamasu creature idea, an undead-beast concept, but h6 one was looking much better than h7 one presented to us.
thank you, good work guys!
hope restored. this time i mean it <3
I can live with the vampire and I really hate the Lamasu. But we are agree that the lich is the priority now!!
Exactly my toughts. They need to work on liches first, vampires second and thirdly lamasus if they are able to.
Yeah. But I would leave the Lamasu and change the spider... It really piss me off. The spider makes no sense with necros
Since Kaspar is a lich, why not make them look more like him?
A fine answer. Two creatures remodeled is better than nothing.
Looks like the current Necro might just rise back from the dead ! ;)
I still think it is way too early to party!!!
Yeah, but only maybe be remodeled. It would be enough if they could remodel it.
LICH AND VAMPIRE FOR REDESIGN!!
So the Lamasu's a lost cause eh?
Thank you devs!!! You guys really are the best! In my opinion, the most important, and best things to do would be:
- Lich to skeletal
- Some changes on the vampire's appearance
- Little more changes on the lamasu's appearance
1-2 choose ;)
Fully concur with Banszien. the devs have been more responsive and collaborative on this edition of Heroes than any previous Heroes game.
In my humble opinion, the lich visual was one of the single weakest elements of Heroes VI. Bringing it back to the skeletal variety of Heroes III or (even better) Heroes V would solve the Uncle Fester complaints.
The biggest issue with the vampire in Heroes VI is that he didn't actually bite anyone. Swords are cool, but the bite is necessary.
A little color would go a long way for the lamasu, even if it's just to the accessories. The overall design is quite good.
As for the others, very impressed with the Grim Rider (a great blend of the Heroes V Wight and Heroes III Black Knight) as well as the Ghost/Banshee. The skeleton and spider are also good - and a spider is necessary in the world of Ashan. And there has never been a truly bad bone dragon, even in the dreadful Heroes IV.
>>We do not make any promise here since we still have to study the impact this change could imply on our side before giving a straight answer in a way or another.
And we do not make any promise to purchase your game since we still have to study the impact this absence of changes we've asked for and recycling old models on our beloved HOMM series.
that seems like a legit way of thinking.
i dont think they will make it remain like that, i mean, after all this...
Anyhow, I will not repeat my mistakes after H6: I will not buy this game without demo or open beta test.
I'm so glad, that there's a lot of people with the same thoughts as me about this. However, I'm surprised in a good way, they reacted at least. Still, I think they just want to appease us, then they'll take their time to let the emotions calm down and leave the recycled models like this wíth some "it was too big change for our development Schedule" excuse. But let's see, maybe they'll surprise us again...
Great. If they don´t want to invest money to the game, we also won´t do it.
If they respect our ideas (for example) change the lich, we will buy the game.
Lich from HoMM5 is the best!
So true,mate,so true!
Agree that H5 Liches were really good. That said, whatever the creatures look like in this game, they shouldn't be a direct copy from ANY game. Something new. And - for the Lich - something skeletal.
H5 Necro rules!
In my deep and personal opinion, I favor Lich from Heroes II. But the one in Heroes V was just fine. ;)
Yes i agree, Lich and Vampire from H2 were the best. BLARGH!!!
I think all necro creatures designs of H5 where better
I would like to say something to everyone.
I've noticed that some people perceive the developer's move as a blessing and a big sign of kindness. In fact they are just rude and cheeky because they try to use the old game and sell it under new label. This is not something you can call making a ne game. There is nothing to be thankful about nor excited. They have been simply caught red-handed and they do not even assured they will fix it.
I've noticed that a lot of you can be fooled so easly.
That's all. You can hate me now.
I'm thankful for not ignoring our butthurt. Some concretness is already good.
But ... let's see what It will be. My beliefs fell 25% down. Definately will not buy this without demo or open beta.
Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me. That's the reason why I won't buy H7 so far...
Such is greed, I suppose. There are some features that are worth to play these games, naturally, although they may take it way ahead and put a too high price to buy them.
I thanked them for their raction. Because I was expecting ignorance from them, like with town screens before. But I am not done yet, I will wait how those changes will look like...
Yeah ... very hard to make "changes" to something they didnt even created and only copied. Development schedule is very cleverly designed indeed. Ubi just know ... almost nobody really cares if game will be ready in 2015 or not - people will live even without this game. Only one who really cares about schedule is your managers.
Hm, you have a good point there. I must say I try to be polite to the team, but some times being aggressive seems to be the only way to get thinks done.. Also, agree 100% with @Logical.dust. it's better to have a great game in 2016 or even 2017, than a crap one late this year. Maybe they should have started this site early so we could have a more active voice from the beggining
Yeah i don't really understand either why ppl are so happy about this reaction. Ok i guess this was needed to calm ppl down, maybe that is a good thing. We are not even sure if we will get wat we want. So why are ppl already acting like we won? I would say hold your horses and wait untill we really get confirmation about the changes and then throw a party.
But i really think this aproach is a bad move from Ubi, especially if they decide not to do anything with it.
Make necropolis less purplish. It is still colorcoding, just this time we have grey/purple, instead of green/black. There is seriously no need for using only two colors. Please add more diversity to unit-design, like you did in academy. I am glad that you removed green from necro- but..! Thing is, that fans hated green, because that green was overused. The color is not problem, overusing is. Try to not overuse purple please.
i realised something about this, units tend to have amethysts on them for god know why. thats a bit repetative and creates purple color-code like you mentioned in your post.
for now, if we think of dark magic-purple connection, it makes some sense to get some purple, but purple gems just doesnt seem to have any logic behind
its just painting units with purple light for no reason.
Maybe in next game spider venom has ran out and necromancy will work with amethysts! -.-
IA, and why the units even need a purplish or greenish color?
C'mon Cleglaw, they need some bling!
Nobody wants dull, grey Necro with creatures that look as expendable as they are right? ... right? Fancy armours and neon glow ftw
@Rodaff they explained that they must implement green and purple in necro as they represent necromancy and dark-magic in their vision.
nah they may be fuel by tears of sandro followers and some sarcastic rakasha ;)
lol. btw, draining colors may end up bad or good i dont know acctually what happens if colors turn to black-white-gray. but also im note very satisfied with "purple or green" attitude.
imma confused maaaan.
Yup, I noticed that gems too. Repetitive. This approach of desing creates illusion of static toy figures made from plastic. They should look more "alive" (or more dead, rather) Haven and academy units are very realistic, and necropolis just look weird compared to them, almost like from different game.
Honestly I think that having too much of any colour is a bad thing no matter if it's green of black. I wouldn't mind some green and purple in Necro, but only if those aren't the only colours. The important thing is to find a balance, I mean H3 Vamps had orange robes and they looked good anyway, because it wasn't overdone and they were the only units with such a colour accent.
As long as the units work/fit as both single and as whole team the colors shouldn't matter. In h6 they just made strong color codes to force units together even if they otherwise would look a bit goofy.
Also anybody know if the game is still aimed to be PEGI 12?
PEGI 16 :P probably, that label is in bottom edge of this blog.
@Violet thx, didn't notice it there. I still remember how early on when this site came to be it was pegi 12 at the first interview I read about regarding this game so was hoping that was just early idea or accident ;)
I'm a sworn enemy of colour-coding. I understand that for example inferno should only use warm colours, but why does necropolis need to have any color theme at all?
Remaining consistent with Ashan universe doesn't mean that liches should look like bald drug addicts. In H5 lich models were pretty good and last time i checked H5 was taking place in Ashan universe.
Yeah, but in h6 they decided the liches gotta have their drink of poison to stay ever so beutiful addicts! H5 is always ready to be retconned as long as the holy cow(h6) is kept power!
What i don't understand is why they decided to go with H6 models instead of letting it be closer to H5, since it takes place 100 years before H5. I know we get stories from other times, but that is not my point. If it is closer to H5 i think it should resemble H5 more than H6.
From a lore perspective, the current lich aesthetic sort of makes sense.
When a wizard becomes a lich, they look the same as in life just with glowing green eyes (see Kaspar) but as time goes by their bodies suffer wear and tear that being undead and not vampires they are either unable or unwilling to repair (see Kaspar after his accident) Left long enough they become completely withered and skeletal (as the H5 liches are)
H7 is set much closer to H6 than H5, so it's liches aren't as decayed
And that shoudn't mean necros as spider lovers either
Okay, most can agree that the lich and vampire are the ones that needs the redesigning the most, right?
I don't dislike the vampire that much to be honest. I think I rather have the skeleton Hoplites changed with less equipment
Let's hope the devs will find the time and resources to do this.
Lamasu is more important, it's a terrible combination of beast and man, should be more beast.
I would have prefer changing the Lamasu instead of the vampire... but yes, that two guys need a redesign.
LICH AND VAMPIRE FOR REDESIGN!!
Please do it devs!! PLEASE!!
MAKE LICHES DRINK NAMTARU AND MANTICORE VENOM!!
AND TOTALLY CONSISTENT WITH ASHAN LORE:
"Drink, liches. Claim your destiny, you will all be conquerors."
Too much WoW there xD. Drinking is never an option, not when it's alcohol, not when it's venom.
@Marblethrone, you're being a nuisance. I haven't see ONE constructive comment from you. I'm providing BOTH art and lore reasons to give ideas for a better Lich, and you just start ranting.
Seriously, start being constructive or just shut the hell up.
Woa, hold yer horses, mate. I was just making an observation regarding your comment. No need to become so grumpy.
So that only WOW can have people drinking thinks now? Should we also limit breathing in Ashan now?Since people in WOW breath no other fantasy universe should be allowed to!
There will probably always be people who will see corresponding events in unrelated games, and believe it was copied, or greatly inspired by one of the two. I don't say that WoW now has the copyright to Drinking, and you're exaggerating a little bit ;).
Though your comment is justified, nontheless.
Art + lore provided. Upvoted
They should listen to you, mate. This game really NEED skeletal liches.
Of course I want to be constructive, and if you look closely you'll see I participate in sharing ideas. But a joke from time to time won't hurt now, right? I didn't mean to dismiss your ideas as copy-paste or idiotic. You're doing great here. Besides, if I never was constructive or of any use, I would still be lagging at the bottom of the level ladder.
And I never shout in caps. Normal letters will do too.
this is the formula for perfect lich, lore-masters! make it happen! :)
@Marblethrone, Sorry I thought you were opposed to the idea and being sarcastic.
Let's just call it a minor misunderstanding ;). I'll be more careful next time.
We need skeletal liches :)
Why is the information shared with us in the time when there is nothing to do and no changes are possible? Shouldnt the things be discussed actaully before they are done? And frankly I couldnt care less if this game is consistent with ashan universe or not, thats another thing you could have discussed before actually making decision. What is our influence here exactly? 6k+ comments regarding some issue and issue might get look upon (but most likely will not) ...
Also you say that you do not support spamming, but for some reason only most spammed ideas ever got atention. Its not humanly possible to take all comments into consideration, but please do not give impression that you actually thinking about each one. Like increasing comment size to at least 1000 letters .. thats like 1 command to change field size in database,1 line of code to set client limit to 1000 and 1 line to server validation. Overall not more than 5 minutes of work. ...
yeah exactly, but ofc if its no trouble for them to show, you know, legal shits and stuff. lol
Or they could make a proper forum or link the Ubi forum. That way the comments won't get flooded and it would be waaay easier to find comments.
Devs, sometimes you have very nice pictures for articles with a nice climate and mature design. The same was with Sylvan voting arts and one art from Dungeon voting. Shouldn't it be the art style of townscreens? :)
My thoughts are same about this topic, I like this fetid and dank feel of the front image....
>>without hurting too much our development schedule
Oh well maybe don't rush it. Take your time. Realese it even in 2016 if you must, but make it worth waiting for. I don't want to play half cooked product because premiere date was running short. Just don't leave things bad becuse there is no time to repair demage :(.
You're damn right!!!
IA. realese it later