To use good things from previous games (especially from Heroes III) is right igea, but please, devs, do not forget about H5. It was brilliant in so many ways. Faction-related abilities, for example. I sincerely hope you will add it to H7. :)
Thanks for the news.
in H5 hero advancement system was especially good, the best in series I think :)
No doubt about that. It made the skill customization very interesting, to say the least.
Agree, for example such features from H5 as random map generator and opportunity to save battle as a video, should be added to H7 I think)
Eeeh... There was RMG in H3 too, and there are many softwares to record videos...
Anyway, +1 to Amelisan, but let's not forget H4 too ! Spell system ie
Skillwheel and its faction-dependent bits has been the best thing since H3. They should really bring it back if they want to do the best Heroes game. It's not just H3.
I also would like to see more creature abilities than shown so far. H6 overdid it, but don't go to the other extreme!
What had H5?
Best skill wheel ever (even though sometimes it was impossible to achieve what one really wants)
Best town screens
Creature spell books + many abilities (having less abilities doesnt mean that we have more to think, total bullshit)
and many more features...
H5 is the best - to cut a long story short.
I want all of these features in H7!
h3 had big influence on h5, so you guys are overreacting to this article. anything close to h3 is automatically close to h5 at some points.
indeed some point of H3 where well used in H5, thats why for me it beat H3, the new things it added made it better :-)
so H5 is still the best :-p
H5 should better considering it was released 7 years after H3. Then 5 years later H6 was released...
Why have you copied my post?
It did have a good skill wheel
- not the best town screens, just 3d ones. Definitly not the best.
And creature spell books was introduced in h4
I upvoted this.
What I failed to mention about less abilities was that it shouldn't come at the expense of the "core" abilities - ie core units crossing entire battlefield within 2 turns as in H6. Abilities are very welcomed as long as they are built upon an already RICH system.
That's what I meant by "more/less to think". Sorry for not being clear.
I love H5's gameplay and enjoyed much creatures abilities there.
@Slumb : Yeah the guy says best TS because it's in 3D. Personally I don't mind, to me best ones are H2/H3's one, but H5 ones are good enough.
I have to say I liked very much H5 skillwheel, seemed like an improvement from the H3's one to me. Not with the best implementation -racials could have been better- but the idea was not bad.
They were not good just because they were 3D. They were generally well-designed, some of them extremely so (Academy and Sylvan jump to mind). I found them gorgeous even when looking from a static 2D perspective.
Stop being such a 2D fetishist :P
Yeah I agree but most people just see the rotating camera you know.
I hope this is just a front they put up to inspire interest. Why are they humouring fans that are ONLY interested in H3? As another user mentioned, plenty of the above info originated in H1 + H2. They are obviously trying to target a part of the community that think H3 is the best and everything else is a disappointment. That particular fan base will not enjoy H7 unless it is a remake. Can Ubi stop trying please this audience: it won't happen! Target Heroes fans, not Heroes 3 fans.
I have a feeling, that it is just special anouncement, dedicated to thing from H3 that will be in H7 and next time we could see the same news about thing from another game. I dont know. Its not like they say "Heroes VII will be ONLY like Heroes III and nothing more, mind you!!1" Just thematic update, nothing to worry about.
I never said that they're making this game like H3. They're not. But they're trying to please fans that can't be pleased. The title of the article is "FROM HEROES III TO HEROES VII" and yet out of the NINE elements talked about in the article, only TWO originated in H3. Personally, I think this article is a punch to the face of every other heroes game (especially 1 and 2).
The thing is that many people picked up HOMM on heroes 3. They probably never cared about the fact that the previous installments had some great material in them as well. They worship III as if its some deity and everything else is rubbish. Every Heroes game had something great, but people spent so much time on 3 (childhood memories I guess?) and think "If its not EXACTLY like 3/WoG its not worth my time". This article, although well-meant, is a bit of a suck-up to 3 fans, I think.
@Khan, H3 fans are the most vocal part of the meta fanbase (and the most likely to piss venom, too). Yeah, this is just pandering to those who are most likely to ignore the game, especially since H6 was such a big departure (and had its share of its own problems to boot) and not give it a fair chance in the long run. Even though H7 will probably be covered in bile vomited by those very fans because it's not H3 enough.
I'd be way more excited if they produced an article that detailed which heroes game each element actually originated from. To say that the magic system is a continuation of what has appeared in numerous heroes games starting with H1 would be great! Or saying that the map editor was originally an idea conceived in H2 would be more beneficial in my opinion than trying to pretend like all of these ideas came from one game. As Aarkill said, this article is a suck-up to H3 fans.
Well, they dont claim this features originated from H3, only that it WAS there. Of course, they speak about most popular game instead of H1 or 2, its marketing, almost the whole this blog is marketing.
Then again, imagine how new players would be enraged if someone promiss them H1-2-like game. Even more than you are now.
You are free to think what you want, of course, I think you sound too dramatic.
Khan: H3 is my favourite game in the serie, but that doesn't mean I like the other ones. H5 was also great, H1 is fun and I still play H2 ! H3 is a reference for me because I spent dozens of hours playing it ! It was challenging, had infinite content, was beautiful. That's all I ask for H7 !
@ KhanOfSlaughter : sure it is posible to please them/us. It is even most simple thing to do. Original lore universe + some gameplay improvements its all it takes. Ashan is definetly not better than original universe ... its just diferent, for no purpose. Perfecting instead of starting over I would say. Targeting H3 fans is not harmfull to any heroes fans, but targeting H6 fans just hurts the H3 ones.
@ logical.dust, while you know exactly what would please you as a heroes 3 fan, you cannot speak for all. I must disagree with your comment on the targeting of fans. The targeting of H3 fans does hurt those who came to the game with H1 and H2, ESPECIALLY when they run an article full of elements that originated in those two games and yet do not even acknowledge the games. Finally, they shouldn't be targeting H3 fans or H6 fans, they should target heroes fans.
"Target Heroes fans, not Heroes 3 fans". I really don't get this quote, maybe is the most stupid thing I ever read in all my life. Heroes 3 is the f*cking best game of Heroes saga. If you don't like it, you just don't like the saga. What kind of fan are you? An Heroes 6 (or should I say "bullshit") fan? What do you want to see? Control areas? Then go to play Disciples and enjoy the control areas. Because that kind of things are not a part of the Heroes saga.
Also, we, the true fans, don't trust in their intention to return to H3. Having the core-elite-champion system instead of the 7 tiers system is enough reason to not trust.
This is not about try to target us, is about try to lie us.
@Tito_Reni, this is why some people treat H3 fans like a joke. One honestly can't take a person seriously when all they do is spew bile, spit venom and piss boiling water. You've called the guy names without even a sliver of respect for his opinion. You've just acted like a butthurt schoolkid.
For a reference, I started with H3. I liked H3 and enjoyed it a lot. But I'll honestly take H6 over H3 any damn time.
@ Tito_Reni, I am a heroes fan, as in, I enjoy playing ALL heroes games, not just one like Heroes 3 fans. I started with H1 and have played all since. You're not a true fan so please don't pretend to be. True fans don't want a return to only one game in the series. True fans see the positives in numerous heroes games and wish them to be incorporated into the next.
@Tito_Reni, also they, the goddamn developers, have their own f*cking head on their shoulders. They were not about to go back to H3 at all, nor they should. Borrow from H3 - fine. Make it H3 - means they don't respect themselves, which they still do.
@Exsul-Aeger You would take H6 over H3 any time? I don't want to live in this world anymore.
Also, I don't want to return to H3, I want a better game. But, right now, H3 is the best of the saga, that's why it's the reference.
@Tito_Reni, fine. You're free not to live in this world anymore. I'm not a hundred bucks to make people change their mind.
I did enjoy every Heroes game (maybe except H4) that came out: I grew up on H1, played for years in H2 and spent endless amounts of time in H3. I see it as the best one so far. Does this make me 'not a true Heroes fan'? I did enjoy both H5 and H6 but still prefer H3 over them.
And I cannot understand how praising H3 may hurt H1 and H2 fans. They should be happy that the game considered to be one of the best TBS games was continuation of those and took so much after them and perfected it
I am sorry I can't downvote the lot of you. There were some decent comments in here but as a whole - baby Jesus on a stick, what a spiteful bunch! From the comments I read I would not consider half of you proper fans. Surely, a lot of things are a matter of opinion and taste, but the way they are worded is like trying to make them sound as an absolute universal truth. Personally I have played all Heroes games and enjoyed every single one of them.... (to be continued)
... with the exception of Heroes IV, which in my personal opinion was a disgrace. Every game has its charm and most of them are keeping to what Heroes is all about. Sure, V and VI are different, but they are absolutely awesome in their own way.
Yes, this post is marketing. You need marketing if you want to sell. Yes, some of the things originate in H1 and H2, but is it really *that* important to you? Pleasing every single fan is impossible, and I think this "discussion" proves just that.
@ ptrsc "I grew up on H1, played for years in H2 and spent endless amounts of time in H3. I see it as the best one so far. Does this make me 'not a true Heroes fan'?"
What have I said that would make you believe I would think that? You need to read my posts more carefully. They are not targeting Heroes 3, they are targeting Ubisoft and those who are fans of heroes 3 and no other heroes games.
@guest-XkDia0rk, am I one of the downvoted? Honestly. I won't be mad :)
Just be mindful when you start calling people 'not true fans', please.
Fully supporting every single word here.
This commuinity has a weird habit of having passionate wars over nothing, starting great storms in a glass of water...
@Exsul_Aeger, no, you ain't mate :D You actually seem like you know what you're talking about, although I do not quite agree with the statement that H6 is better than H3, but as I have said - it is purely a matter of taste/opinion. I don't judge ;)
@ptrsc, so it would seem. Having heated conversations about stuff and ending them with a pint - fine. Measuring each other's private parts in an internet "argument" over silliness - something I had hoped not to see so much in the Heroes community.
Hahah, very true! ;D
@guest-XkDia0rk, that's what I'm talking about. We don't have to always agree but we have to respect each other's opinions. Also, I'm not saying H6 is better or worse than H3, I just like it more. I do have strange preferences, though :D
@ ptrsc - "Just be mindful when you start calling people 'not true fans', please"
I was. I considered what Tito_Reni had to say, claiming that he was a true fan and implying that true fans want a return to H3, but that Ubisoft could not be trusted to do that. So I feel that I was justified in saying that he was not a true heroes fan. A true heroes 3 for sure, but a fan of the entire series? I think not.
@Exsul-Aeger, I apologize, my mistake. I can see how you can prefer 6. I, myself, find it rather awesome XD
Don't we all :D I, for one, would not see this particular one (H6 over H3) as a strange one. I would have raised hell (in my mind :P) though if you had said you preferred H4 over whichever of the others :D
In my opinion (and quite a few other fans, to the best of my knowledge) this does not even count as a Heroes game.
I think people should stop labeling H3 fans as whiny assholes that cannot enjoy any other games.
I'm a H3 fan, but I'm also a H2 and H5 fan. + I loved some elements of H4 like spell system ie.
Truth is, H3 community is maintained alive, mostly by modders that put considerable amount of time to provide mods of extraordinary quality, and they don't even take part in this forum.
The people I saw whining the most here are not H3 fans, EVERYBODY fucking complains here.
Hey guest-XkDia0rk, H4 is my favourite ;) haha
@guest-XkDia0rk, well, I wouldn't exactly call H4 a bad game. Subpar, maybe. I did like it way back when. As of now I would be rating it rather low as a Heroes title, but on its own... I can imagine worse.
@ KhanOfSlaughter : I really do not want to argue about this as it would take enormous time, but I can tell you that there is someone at ubisoft who desperately trying to turn this game to something else despite the fact that it is more than clear what people really want. Some examples: random skillsystem, importance of townscreens, only pointless cosmetic changes instead of some gameplay improvements. Its frustrating to see one bad decision after another, their management suck completely.
@logical.dust : Actually that wouldn't surprise me, if it were to be true, it would explain a lot regarding H6.
@Khan Maybe is because I was in rage and I didn't express my thoughts well. I think H3 is the best, but that doesn't mean I don't like the others. I like every heroes game, except H6, which is an abomination. H1 has the best townscreens ever (because it had people in them), H2 is one of the best HoMM games ever made (the second best for me, after H3), and H4 had very interesting things (like the caravans). Finally, H5 (TotE) was the way to follow, until Ubisoft screwed up everything making H6.
Now, instead of following H5, H7 is following H6. Fuck everything.
@Khan, you are dead to me :D
@Exsul-Aeger, on its own it isn't *that* bad, this is true. If you ignore the fact it's supposed to be a Heroes game it is playable, but back in the day when I tried it out I could not get over it :D Perhaps I should give it another go in the foreseeable future, see if I hate it as much some years later :D
@Tito_Reni, can't quite see how Ubisoft "screwed up everything". I'd really like to know how exactly you find H6 an "abomination"? Please, do tell, I'm curious.
Do I really need to explain why H6 is the worst HoMM game ever? If you can't understand why, I'm sorry, I'm so sorry, but I really think I cannot explain anything to you. After all this time, you should know why. And I am not feeling with the strength to enumerate all the failures from H6, which are the entire game.
Ask why H6 is bad is like ask why the nazis are evil. You should know why.
"Do I really need to explain" - yes, you have. Unless you don't have your own opinion.
"you should know why" - apparently I don't. So why not, you know, explain?
"Ask why H6 is bad is like ask why the nazis are evil" - sure, why? They were enforcing purity of my race, so would you please explain I'm supposed to think they were evil?
Honestly, dude. Chill.
Exsul-Aeger said : "For a reference, I started with H3. I liked H3 and enjoyed it a lot. But I'll honestly take H6 over H3 any damn time."
I can't see how a H3 lover could pick H6 over it anytime. H6 is like antithesis of H3 lol.
You are in your right to enjoy H6, but I think you are the one that needs to explains himself for such statement lol.
@GalaadleHaut, of course lol.
The reasons are more subjective than objective. It's in presentation. To me H3 seems incoherent and mishmash-y, its story - bland, despite having some good moments here and there. I never delved deep into the mechanics of either H3 or H6, there's nothing to radically set them apart. Four resources instead of seven? Bah, never cared in H3, certainly don't care in H6. Non-random skill tree? Well, they gave me that and I'm gonna use it. And so on. (character limit)
I'm aware I'm not much of a hardcore gamer OR Heroes fan. Maybe this helps me being less biased towards one specific game. Also, I know that H6 did make certain things easier and to require less thinking, but again, it's kinda to my liking.
I'm aware H6 has its share of problems. They don't bug me (aside from poor optimization, that one does). I'm aware H6 did a lot of things differently compared to a classic HoMM game. (character limit)
I commend the devs for trying, even if it didn't end up being done that well. Again, it didn't bug me.
Also, I'm not an H3 lover. I'm an H3 liker. Same thing with H6. I was never playing Heroes because the games were smart. I was playing Heroes because I just happened to like how the games are played.
"but I think you are the one that needs to explains himself for such statement lol." - It wasn't a bold statement, man. I'm just saying I like H6 more, is all.
Again, I don't want to waste time explaining why this game is an abomination. So, if you want to know, enter in Steam and read the negative critics to Heroes VI. Here: http://store.steampowered.com/app/48220/
Been there, seen that. Half of the negative reviews don't even say anything about the game, only throwing like a single line about Conflux implementation. Half of another half of these reviews are also nothing but bitching. The objective half of the reviews barely ever call it anything close to an abomination. No credit here.
If you don't want to waste time, you can't hope to convince people.
I won't be replying here anymore, I get tired of scrolling all the way down.
Even if MMH6 has a few fans, it doesn't change the fact that it has the most distant gameplay from any other game of the franchise.
Said I won't be replying here anymore but what the hell.
No, no it doesn't.
What a relief to hear Magic Attack/Defense stats are gone. I hated them so much.
So true, i agree you %100. That thing made some creatures useless on might and others useless on magic heroes, especially against high level heroes. This is a good ridance.
All of us!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The question is how is is going to be calculated? Is it going to be like in Heroes 3, which means when attack is going to be higher than def, the total dmg will be extra 5% for each point of attack higher than def... Can't wait for the mechanics and stats of creatures...
I say it was a good idea, but badly implemented. For instance, in previous games Knowledge gave you +10 to spell points. I guess they could merge Magic Defense and Spirit, Magic Attack with the Magic etc. so we may get some interesting gameplay.
Yes that was another of H6's "great improvements" lol
H3, H3, H3... C'mon... many of those features were introduced in H2. Some were present even in H1...
But it makes the fans feel like the game is more like H3...
but it's simply nothing but white lies
It's the basics of that game, and therefor it makes the two of them look more akin to eachother...
still, those features were not taken from 'illustrious' H3...
I agree with you. Many of those features in H3 were already in H2, but in many ways, H3 polished them, so it´s logic they put it as an example(in adition to the comercial reasons).
Remember, they're not coming out with a Heroes 2 HD edition in January
In case you didn't notice, Ubisoft is a business machine.
But Limbic seems to be real nice guys :good:
I think they just speak of H3 because that's its 15th birthday... it wasn't intending to hurt H1 & H2 fans...
Is this so big a deal ?
"In Heroes VII, creatures tend to have less abilities, and use more passive abilities similar to those found in Heroes III (e.g.: Medusa attacks have XX% chance to turn enemies to stone). Some trigger on critical attacks, some work all the time, overall, the player has less to read and click, and more to think. "
No, not really. It is less to think, period.
I was just about to comment that. Have my upvote.
I want more abilities :( Two is not enough especially for champion creatures.. In H4 some creatures had even 4 abilities. I really loved that
No. The less abilities you have the more you think.
Having too many creatures ability makes it too reliable, you will read and clic and think AT FIRST, but at some point you will end up doing your favorite combos, just like a non-random skill system. Bad for replayability.
With lesser abilities, you have much more opportunities for tactics, as you don't depend and rely on the abilities.
I think it's nice to have some abilities, but not too much.
The main problem I see with abilities so far is that they seem too similar between factions (Sweeping, Piercing shot...)
H6 overdid it. Period. But they should cap the number of abilities at 3 or 4, instead of just 2. Creature abilities differentiate them, make them more interesting and gameplay more fun.
Main Features that are needed:
1. Different Choices for Upgraded Unites (Heroes V Tribes) - This was the best Idea
2. Ultimate Skills (Heroes 5)
3. Blood and Tears Paths (Heroes VI)
4. Redesigned Skill Tree, No more Random Skills and VI's Tree over the top. Simple but Flexible
5. Redesigned Mage Guilds, so sick of Random Spells.
6. Random Maps (Heroes III)
7. Perfect Faction Balance (Heroes III) (wasn't perfect but was closest)
Yes! I very much agree but randomness can be very fun and I would add:
8. 3D town screens in heroes V are just awesome, it gives immersion beyond just an image.
Eh? Heroes 3 the closest to perfect faction balance? Looks like someone needs to play Heroes 5 again...
You said it, man (or beast). :)
Those 7 features along with the 8. 3D town screens are the best ideas that I most want to appear in HOM&M VII. I hope you have enough "up vote" for the developers to start noticing our wishes.
I'd add a 9th one too. Well this isn't a feature technically, but still. AI time. Heroes 3:perfect. Heroes 6:good. Heroes 5: Oh my God? what is this?!. But seriously, "we used to play in HoMM3 2 aginst 6 and we finished it in one night on an xxl map with underground. That was impossible on HoMM5 even with large map and 3 opponents against us, because the AI has taken it's sweet time on it's turns." I know it won't be easy, but please try to optimize the AI turns in skirmish matches.
Agreed with the ideas above .... and please dont forget about the griffons....it;s what makes heaven faction to be heaven (wolwes can remain too as an alternative creature )
For the multiplayer , how do you guys feel about a play-by-mail system? kind of like on the game Frozen Synapse on Steam where you'll get a notification when it's your turn (in this case when you log in to the Steam client you get a message) and you can get back to it when you can. Heroes games can go on for quite long and with life getting in the way most people won't be able to commit to a long play session.Also, how do you feel about simultaneous turns?
Oh and um, I'm not sure whether the upgrade option should be like on HOMM 5 where it was the same base creature upgrade with different abilities and a different look/lore, or a choice between two different creatures altogether like on HOMM 4? A hybrid of the two systems? Maybe not all creature tiers get upgrades but a select few just to test the concept out. Thoughts?
Allright i think you guys(development team) is making a big mistake right here. Give marksman a different ability instead of piercing shot and landsknetch/swordman a different ability instead of sweep. Disciples have piercing shot and rakashas have sweep. Sorry but you are being lazy here, if you are going to put few abilities at least let them be unique and different. Use you immagination, we don't want to see same abilities on every faction, you really need to think about this againç
Damn you non-existing edit button!!!
Marksmen should have a passive. Tier one shooter, it's just a guy with a crossbow with some armor on. Double shot or no range penalty should be his thing.
Idk what to say about sword master, only thing that comes to mind is double attack because of the old Paladins.
You are probably right, what i am complaining here is the repetition of skills. If they are going to give armor piercing to marksman then they should give disciples another ability or vice versa. Same goes for Landsknetches/swordmasters and rakashas too. Their abilities especially abilities of champion units must be special. I advice giving marksman armor piercing shot and giving landsknetch/swordman extra damge against champion units.(i am open for opinions)
Yea I get what your saying, and I agree. I understand skills like no retaliation being re-used but sweep and pierce shot should be faction specific skills.
If this doesn't get changed, I can easily see sweep showing up at least one more time for the blade dancers. Skills is not nessarily something they should take right out of h3. H4 did an awesome job providing unique skills for all factions and giving spell casters a spell book. Same with h5.
I agree about the marksmans - they need different ability. Also remember description of Dungeon´s Stalkers ? They said they will also have this ability .. kinda silly if you ask me. I suggest to give Marksman armor piercing, so they will ignore 50% enemys defence, or something like that... crossbows are good against heavy armor, so that would fit them good.
But I have no problem with the sweep ability on more units. H6 lacked units with AoE attack, so having more of those is ok for me ;-)
Dragon Blood: Increased chance to perform critical and increase morale by xx%
Accuracy: Increased chance to reduce ranged penalty by xx%
Precision: Increased chance to perform critical by xx%
Inspiring: Increased chance to raise morale
Devotion: Unit is not affected by negative morale or Leadership
Uncontrolled magic: Chance to hit friendly units in line of attack by xx%
should i go on? :P
100% agree with Kaanzakin.
Each abilities have to be unique to creature and faction style. Sweep & Piercing shot, in Haven OR in Academy, NOT in both !!!
What had H3, what H5 doesnt have? I have always seen it like improved H3.
Best skill wheel ever (even though sometimes it was impossible to achieve what one really wants)
Best town screens
Creature spell books + many abilities (having less abilities doesnt mean that we have more to think, total bullshit)
and many more features...
I agree. In my opinion, H5 has been the best Heroes Saga.
h5 didnt had best town screens, they were worst of all series. (most unfunctional and undetailed). on the other hand h3 had best.
spells in h5 were tottaly annoying and not enough compared to h3 spells.
racial skills were making towns even more different then each other which i think is a bad thing. you have a lot of different stuff allready why also making skills/spells different? too overdone.
initiative system was a good idea but it was acctually confusing.
on the other hand, i agree with you on one thing. "alternate upgrades" were good and i think it should be in h7 too.
Simply I have nothing to add ... H5 was the best
i think so. H5 is the best. i hope this one is not the copy of H3.
HoMM 5 is after M&M: Heroes 6 worst optimalized in the whole franchise.
It does not run smoothly on more modern computers, turns are way too long...
It was pionering in terms of graphics and technology (3d used both on map, townscreen and battlefield) but, as many games and series that converted to 3d in that time, it quickly faded and textures quickly became not as impressive
I play HoMM 3 and have a lot of fun even now, HoMM 5 is just way too long
+ it would be weird to write that they return to HoMM 5 when HoMM 5 itself was return to basics.
Some of stuff above was present already in HoMM 4- initiative, creature spell book and abilities (each unit at least one, some even 4 characeristics), skill wheel was also present
town screens as 3d are cool but always preferred HoMM 3 style- more detailed. Nowadays, when engines are improved, there could be 3d towns...
Every Heroes game since third one have something special what they can add, H3 is a good game but i still play all of them because of different features they can offer.
H1+H2 are just simple versions of H3
H3 is great as a whole game but his older brothers can outmatch him in many cases
H4 in my opinion was best in case of magic, makes might heroes not useless anymore, great story and offers many strategic variations because of selective dwelings
H5 already written about it
H6 one does simply like when he can choose some important skill in right time and i really like the Core/Elite system
sorry for english and some mistakes im tired
lol you guys are funny.
H5 is so great exactly because it is very similar to H3. Yes it has gameplay improvements.
But yes it has (apart the TS) horrible 3D too.
H5 lacked the atmosphere, trying to be WoW or WH, even chinese HOMM ripoffs looks better lol.
H5 was a step in the right direction regarding gameplay though, with that I agree, but what H3 have that H5 doesn't definitely is the atmosphere. The visuals, the graphics, the environment, the oniric aura.
Alright, I'm gonna be burned for this but anyway : Yes Heroes III was great and I still cherish it to this day. It was a blast. But guys, God I can smell how much Heroes 6 was a failure for you to have this talk. Thanks for Heroes III in HD but... Ah, to me you seem like "desperate"... "let's redo H3"... It's lovely and awesome to redo H3 but to save Heroes... Ahhhh I'm not sure how to say this : "have some balls",
yes we love so much our past game but surprise us, be YOURSELF instead of just deciding to copy. To me you seem lost behind doing a good Heroes VII and looking at the past. Guys, give us something new and good. Yes H3 is top of the top, but you shouldn't be looking to recreate , you should be looking to do even better
Sorry for the spam. And I'll finish. As much as I loved H3 and as much as I love you going back to it... The only path to improvement is change and thank you for asking for our opinion, really but... make it special, make it yours, try to do something unique instead of only looking at the past and our feedback?
Ok people you can kill me :p
In that I agree.
It should be a mixture of all heroes because each of them has had some good features, even Heroes IV (e.g. mobility of neutral units), but especially Hereos III and V (town screens, really good combination of active and pasive skills along with spells etc.)
I think that they are doing good decision with this. And I personaly dont want new "improvement" of gameplay. I will be happy with new designs for units new faction etc.. :)
there are plenty of changes being made. Like flanking, control zones, new forts, the new tiers, lack of fliers. They're doing it right by making the combat and units like heroes 3 in an updated heroes game.
@Demnia, I agree with you 100%. This Heroes III devotion is borderline mauvais tone now. But at least Limbic mixes HIII with both new features and those from the later games. I'm personally more than okay with this but I honestly think they should stop comparing HVII to HIII in the future since it doesn't help HVII become a distinctive entry and just makes it a rehash of an older title.
Then again, unfortunately, this IS good marketing... I guess we can't really blame them for this.
@Exsul-Aeger : You said everything I think, I have nothing more to add =)
I have to agree with you on this. As I have pointed out on previous post, It seems they are focusing all around H3... What about others games? H5 was a great one too!
I applaud these comments.
Demnia, I hear you but :
1) So far MMH7 doesn't have THAT much in common with H3 :)
2) Last time Ubisoft tried to be innovative it didn't turn out so well :)
3) I appreciate what the devs are doing : gathering this from H2-H3, that from H4-H5, they even kept the area control from H5. And as Exsul said the H3 references are mainly for marketing, but anyway, what's the harm in picking up stuff from H3, the pinnacle of the series ? :)
area control from H6*
Very good desicions, i especially liked how the map generator is going to turn out aand return of 7 resource system again but i couldn't see the random skills you should add it too.
Ah Kaanzakin, at least your posts are good :P
Thanks :P yours are fine too ^^
You didn't mention anything bout initiative and speed? Is it gonna be more like H3, H5 or sadly H6? The initiative system worked the best in H5, and actually speed the same. There was huge variety between very slow and very fast unit. H6 was total crap cause they all had almost the same speed
I think they said (don't remember where though) that they're gonna reuse H6 initiative system.
Maybe someone else has more reliable information :)
And I agree, H5 had the best speed/initiative system so far
They've already said h5 initiative system would be too much work. H6 was easier system to make so they went with that. They confirmed this at the twitch demo.
What? Are you kiddin me? Too much work? What the hell that supposed to be?
Heroes 6 had too many activated abilities, like 4-5 per faction. Its like creatures power came from the activated ability instead from the creature itself. I did not like this, especially when they were mostly used to negate retallion. Heroes 3 had few passive abilites on creatures and it was too little. Heroes 5 found the perfect balance with caster creatures, meaningfull abilities and plenty of unique passive abilities.
No town conversion? Questionable achievement. Again we'll have to play for demonic hero with sylvan army. Or something like that. With low morale.
Heroes III were nice, but let them be. Design something new. And I'm not the one, who says such things and then says that the new game is horrible. My favourite game is Heroes IV, so don't think that I'm saying that just to have an opportunity to criticize this game later.
May Heroes lll remain Heroes lll. And the Heroes Vll may be something new.
Agreed, town conversion is one of the best innovations in a Heroes game. It's a shame they've decided not to include that in VII.
In H4, you alway could buy a hero of castle's faction. So there is not this problem.
And many players like to have combination of different faction units, you loose moral but gain new way to play.
Najakir, yes I coul buy hero of castle's fraction, but my army will be scattered between few races and with town conversion I could avoid that. And morale in Heroes 4 differs from morale in other Heroes. You do not lose your turn in HMM 4 because of low morale and in the others you do. So either no town conversion without loosing turn because of bad morale, or town conversion with possibility of loosing turn.
Moreover, I'm sure that there will be a lot of ways of decreasing your morale.
Town conversion was a great idea, but poorly implemented... if they had made it so, it only was optinal, and that when you decided to convert a city, you would loose all the buildings in it...
I think that without some of H6's not so great idea (Psst, I'm talking about the recruitment system and the town portals), It could actually work really well. The same goes for the pother great features of heroes VI, such as the blood/tear heroes and might/magic stats...
This should be optional in the game settings. We should be able to configure the gameplay to our likes in many other respects.
I agree with mediczero on town conversion + recruitment system.
Actually the article above is kinda deciving. As I mentioned before there are many things (Hero stats, Resources, etc.) which were implemented before Heroes 3. So it won't be HoMM3 in better Graphics, I believe they try to collect from all the games the best. (I can understand that HoMM5 townscreens are out of budget, still I'd like to see them,) Also there are some things missing which still can come like alternative Upgrades...
... 1 for more attacks one for more defence.
More free szenarios -> town must be conquered to get through portals, gates, use shipyard etc.
In the end I have the feeling that they are on the right way, although I start to doubt them capability again. (H6 was a bug desaster and with the 3 weeks ago mentioned website-update for academy).
For sure I won't be pre-ordering again, but I will definitly follow the development of it.
You are claiming so many things should be optional. But do you realize how much additional work is it to do change a lot of gameplay effects?
I understand that they are trying to combine the best features of all Heroes. But are these features realy the best?
And after such statement "plenty more elements from Heroes III" and "Heroes VII is deeply inspired from Heroes III" most fans would be waiting for HMM 3, but in better graphics. After such words I wouldn't like to be in dev's shooes after releasing this game.
I'm not claiming things should be optional. Only that they should be logical and user-friendly.
And I also don't see that changing gameplay will be solution. Too much work for devs.
GlorfindelElven said "Again we'll have to play for demonic hero with sylvan army. Or something like that. With low morale."
Well then you play with Devil, Bone Dragon and Hydra in the same army you know, it is cool :)
About morale you need skill or artifacts... It works too.
I understand Town Conversion, but the problem is, if the feature's in, you will be forced to use it, is best to have 30 Devils than 10 champ of each evil alignment. I like it better to mix troops.
Could be an option.
@Energy : Well some things should be optional.
GalaadleHaut you need to calm down, Napoleon Bonaparte : ))
Town conversion was stupid and ridiculous idea. Next stage of this idea would be hero conversion.
You are not forced to use this option:)
If there is such option it's up to you whether to use it or not. If you like 3 champion units of each race, than you may have it. And if one wants 1 extrabig champion unit of one race, he could have it too. Existence of such option does not demand using it;)
I think having same army is more powerful with Town Conversion. Mixed armies might get crushed, but if I'm wrong you need to explain with something better than suppositions :)
I think the option should be Town Conversion ITSELF :)
But Random Skills is a more important issue to me.
Cool down a bit:)
I'm not trying to prove that you're wrong. I'm just explaining my point of view.
So do I, no harm dude :)
Worst thing is probably no town conversion. it would be awful to see gameplay 16 years old without such improvement. should have been combination of H5 and H6, or something ew would be even better
najakir- so what if you're getting new way to play if you have already chose your faction and you don't need it? Let just everything be random whichever faction you use. why then such story and marketing with all these races if they won't be? It's not chess. that's why chess is so boring. Everything is equial
We don't want everything to be equal, the current 3 tier system and town conversion from 6 encourage all towns being equal because of the limited flexibility if you want a faction to be decent, you needed to make it like every other one.
Vretence is not making any sense at all. Such toilet statements.
We need more creature abilities!
We need more variety between creature abilities.
Nice to see that I am not the only one who want this.
For me it is even more importent then random skills.
Random skills are primordial. But they need to be well-thought. It's not like it's totally random you know.
Sooo, now all we need is random skill system :)