Also aside from magic guilds, we want lots of efffective spells. Direct damage spells were useless in H6 and i hope that mistake will not be repeated and give us both our favourite spells from old Heroes games and new, unique and fun to cast spells.
100% agreement! H5 magic structure for me was awesome - ballanced and effective. While H6 sucked in the area of destructive magic. Not to mention their graphics cause it is matter of taste.
The source of crap was in the separation of each race's heroes into a magic and might. Might heroes affects the damage of might creatures when magic creatures were almost useless. And magic heroes affected the damage of magic creatures while might part of the army was completely useless. If they did powerfull spells with such system, it would cause huge imbalanse in the game. So the whole concept was WRONG.
I'd prefer to see good old fashion in H7: might races and magic races. Not both characters inside the each race. Who's the heck idea was to make hardcore melee warlocks?! =\ That's ridiculous.
only would ask for some balance for spells (or even cut them, they too affect game):
- mass spells like slow, haste etc (3rd or 4th mage guild)
to be honest, te last time there were truly might and truly magic factions was HoMM 2- barbarian and knight were might and the rest (wizard, warlock, necromancer and sorceress) were magic
Since HoMM 3 each faction has one magic and one mght hero (exception was stronghold in HoMM 4). Although also might heroes in tower in hoMM 3 (alchemist) still was decent magician and magic heroes of stronghold were better warriors than most of the might hereos of other factions...
I think that except armageddon, divine vengance and few other spells generally everything was properly working. Slow-haste/purification/healing tent, cloning-distance creatures/balista/spells, hypnotize/frenzy-healing hands/healing tent/immune to magic/purification. Every spells/ability had it's own opposite, something to fight with.
depends, in HoMM 4 hypnotize was waay to strong (evne against necro due to thae fact that hero could be hypnotyzed...)
and dimension spell is always too broken :( It is just annoying when the opponent is using it and if player get it the game becomes way too easy. This spell and town portal were the most imbalanced spells in HoMM 3...
divine vengance I do not recognize. Armageddon is balanced- fair cost and risk, Only problem is when there is army as Conflux- 4 strongest creatures immune
I agree, but let's not forget the basics such as Slow/Haste, Bless/Disrupting ray etc :)
Looking very much forward how Magic system will be in H7 though ! ;)
Direct damage spells 'useless'? Implosion, Lightning Bolt, Fire Bolt (and related spells), Chain Lightning, Ice Bolt etc...a level 30 magic hero with a high amount of Magic Power turns these spells into army-decimating devices. Armageddon? Love it, that's a good way to handle your opponent in a duel. A hero with all these spells is a force to be reckoned with.
To be honest, I really liked this news and magic system.
Guys, really, stop with this overwhelming criticism. You know, it's the first Heroes game that is actually made with fans. I know that townscreens aren't perfect ... but devs still deserves some appreciation.
Devs are just doing their job. They are doing it nice, the problem is that initial design is stripped out so it fits ridiculous ubi budget expectations. Less factions, less spels, terrible townscreens, 'if game sells well' attitude. Ubi dont care about the game at all. All they care about is money and short term goals, nothing more. If they could release game now they just would. Game doesnt need to be perfect but it has to be better than games made years ago omg (and not only graphicswise).
Yeah have been saying this from the beginning. Ppl just don't see it because they get blinded by greed (H3 influences that doesn't make any sense. Yes i am looking at you Dungeon line-up voting) and are in an exstace because thier favorite H3 is beeing mentioned. And probably because of other stuff too.
"Made with fanse" cmon! They could have been done much better work if they would actualy read what their fans are writing HERE. And if they really wanted to here our opinions the Community Section would have been finished AT FIRST. If you read 20+ Comments here, you see nearly all are talking about the same, if we had just one article in a Forum, we and the dev. team could work with it much better and easier...
I just hating them for fooling the community.
Yeah they told us this was the "official site" for H7, but they take more time to be on the Heroes Community forums. And the H7 forums on the Ubi forums is almost dead (in my eyes). Never seen them ever give a reaction there. But i haven't been there for a while so maybe they did react.
Of course they just care about money. The are a business and this is a good thing. We tell them what we like here and the better they are at giving us what we want the more money they make.They have every incentive to listen so just state what you think politely.
Fair warning, rant incoming
Oooh, and this is where the problem arises. Most businesses now exist to make money for the shareholders. This leads to making short term-high profit plans that kill the company long terms. You see it all the time, record profits being accompanied by layoffs, the cheapening of materials, lowering the budget for new products. But things like this kill the brand name and eventually can lead to the demise of a company due to not being able to make money.
Because they have let too much collapse and cannibalized themselves too much for short term gain.
The primary goal of companies used to be and should be IMO to provide a product that people wish to buy and derive profits from this. This also builds the brand name by making them known for making good things. Much like 3DO did.
Much of the problem is short term thinking to maximize profits, such as releasing sub-par games in this case and relying on brand name to make a profit.
So, while they should listen to people, they believe that if they can do a good job of simulating listening to the community while keeping the budget low, they will make a large profit because much of the player base will still buy it.
Honestly the best thing that can happen with the Heroes franchise IMO unless they really hit this one out of the park is for it to be sold to a smaller company that has the drive to make H8 a great game and appeal to the fans and isn't just worried about money.
Supporting all that you said, that's exactly how I see the market right now. And you're right about franchise too, it's sad however that this process (getting H8 under new franchise owner) would take some 8 years or more, in my opinion... :(
Yeah, that's the main downside. Still, I'd rather wait and have something that blows the rest out of the water, than in that same period get 2 or 3 bad games that risk ending it all.
Heroes fans have the shortest memories of most gaming fans I know. This "call" for a new company to be in charge of the Heroes franchise is oddly familiar. At the time of Ubisoft's acquisition of the Heroes franchise, fans were spouting their delight that a new company had taken it and that things could only get better. Suffice to say, they were delusional. Just as any fan who thinks the answer is for a new company to gain control of Heroes, is delusional.
We have seen what a new company would do with a game like Heroes. They try to make their own version of it. They try to make their own legacy by moving the game away from what made it great. We are already at that place now. If this game goes to another company now, then they will do the EXACT same thing: create their own version that will take it even further away. You would have to suffer through another Heroes 6.
The game cannot stay in the same form for all releases, it has to change, evolve to provide better gameplay and more fun, otherwise even the best formula will get boring eventually. Even 3DO and NWC knew that and constatnly made changes - that went in the wrong direction and weren't well received in the end. Now Ubi is reaching similar point so perhaps it's time to look for someone else. It can't be much worse than H6 so why not give it a try?
Nah NWC would have made an excellent HV, without 3DO.
Not that hard lol
3DO indeed is responsible for the rush of IV, and Ubi well, we all know lol
Thumbs up to OP though
You certainly do run the risk of a new company doing something foolish, but honestly I've lost much of my faith in UBI and will likely wait for some time after release to see fan reviews of the game so I don't waste money on a bad game.
So while it has risks, I think that the rewards could well be worth it. It just needs to get into the hands of a company that listens to the community and take pride in their work IMO.
Hey maybe if we keep announcing new stuff people will forget how much the towns suck.
I prefer to think of it this way:
We get new stuff to talk about, which draws our attention away from the TownScreens so they can improve them big-time and give them back to us, stunning and amazing all of us with them. Think positive, give these hard-working people a chance!
...And there's not even any new stuff here-_-
lol ur right, there isnt anything new here.
I hated it how people kept spamming all the posts about random skills, but u know what, I hate the towns more. So many complained about them after Gamescon but we were mostly ignored & told going 2D is a budget thing & the town screen there was just a early version. Most of us accepted that however our fears that the 2D artwork would stay being of such cheap quality were confirmed when the Academy screen was released & now Haven showing little change.
@blueraven, And I've been observing this forum for a long time and those with no intellect like yourself have continued to grow in number on this forum meaning those who had anything interesting or productive to say have left due to the amount of unintelligent morons such as yourself who continue to post the same pile of shit over and over and over and over again.
@blueraven, If you don't know what I mean, look at your most upvoted comments: the top one is spam, all the rest are whiny complaints. It lowers everyone's IQ to the point where all they can do is post a hashtag with 4 letters because they're not intellectually capable of posting more than that.
I'm with KhanOfSlaughter
@ blueraven, you are one of the most annoying posters on here. You have no right to attack anyone else on what they post considering the amount of spam and negative posts you do.
If something is done badly or poorly I will criticise it. Someone has to be in contrast to you. If not we will have another H6 again because obviously you will accept everything just because of stupid excuses.
If not spam there wasn't be a chance for #GURS.
Most annoying? It seems that not for everyone. It's nice to see there are others, not like you ;-)
Oh, Damian. One more thing. I wasn't the first one here who attacked someone ;-)
But you joined spam whit # so spamming now is ok i didn't know that and but when someone was pointing it. For me its like mom he insulted me when i was doing something wrong waaah
Just instead of magic give to stronghold blood cries like heroes V!So,so,so,so,so,so,so,so amazing idea!
Sounds interesting. Didn't like the skill system and spells in H6. Was more a fan of the spells and skill system in H5<
I think the skill/spell system in H6 was gold (I mean, forever love the Cleave and Heroic Charge abilities for a level 15 Might hero), because it was something new again, rather than the old stuff over and over. Maybe I've grown too accustomed to H6 and less to older games. Still, having the Magic Guilds back again doesn't make me sad, it's just a new way of embracing ye olde ways of doing again.
nice try making us forget
(spell system looks okay btw)
OK, that's all good but they ain't real news. We've known or suspected as much.
What would be interesting to hear is how will the spells be balanced. Will we see spells affecting both battle and map? How do they scale from various levels? Will some magic power up or will all of them be new?
Is there a way to counter one spell with another? Can you combine spells? etc
The 'Instant Travel' spell was a neat one in HoMM 5, bringing that back would be awesome. Do you refer to the 'Empowered' spells we knew from the Dungeon Faction in HoMM 5? That could be interesting, giving a hero the ability to increase the power of a spell (at the cost of more mana), which would be different than spells dealing more damage or lasting longer as the hero gains more Spellpower. I assume they will keep that, at least.
Combined spells...has there ever been a HoMM game with that?
Well not direct spell combining, but in h4 you could combine spell-schools to create new spells(like nature + death gave you "summon devil"-spell I think).
The only other one I know is the Imbued Arrow from HoMM 5, but that's just the Sylvan hero's normal attack with a spell in it. That's just not the same, but who knows...that too could return.
About countering spells...a hero reacting to another hero? Wouldn't that only work if their turns were directly after one another? You can debuff the enemy and he can simply 'cleanse' them again...the most effective trollspell was Magic Mirror :P, hitting YOU with your own spells.
This makes me think that there needs to be a prime spell, Counter-Spell which causes your hero to wait until the enemy hero is about to cast something and then burns 50% more mana to totally stop its effect from taking place. So you use your turn +50% more mana to stop an opposing hero from casting something.
I guess that would be one of the few, if not the only way of countering a spell. Good thought!
Thx, I actually took the thought from another game and modified it to fit this one better, but there are enough systems that have something like this I can't imagine it's infringing on anything.
Even though I've often used them, I've often felt that there were too few ways to counter a nuke mage. And this way the defender is still put on a timer unless they have many more spell points than the attacker. And they are forced to not use their hero in order to cancel out the other person's hero.
I think it should also be far enough along the prime tree that not everyone can get it but close enough to make it accessible by early-mid game. So I'd put it at level 2 or 3 depending on how accessible one wants it to be, I'd probably tend towards level 3 to show that it is an advanced and difficult technique, but still easy enough that most can do it with training.
Nuke mages...brings back memories (A Battle Lost and Won, H6 Haven Campaign). If you're unfortunate enough that the enemy army has a higher initiative which allows the enemy hero to act first, he or she can already inflict damage before countering is even an option. I wonder if heroes will get an individual turn again, or at the turn of the first friendly creature. Blocking it for a faction? That's...evil. Send in the nuke mages to swat Those Who Could Not Counter :D!
I generally build mages as nuke mages, I remember at one point in H3 getting a caster that could do somewhere around 2k damage per implosion. He did so much the stacks of black dragons were actually more dangerous to me than azure dragons because they lacked magic immunity.
And in H5 Zehir is just insane esp on knowledge by the time you finish the game. Seriously, wound up with over 50 knowledge and around 30 sp on the guy.
Well, in disciples, you could use magic to inflict damage to your opponents army in the battlefield. Dunno if it could be used here as well. As for empowering, i meant that if by using a spell it can gain exp and evolve (fireball - fireblast - Inferno etc), also, if i have basic fire magic and then go to master, will my spells do more damage or do i just learn new spells (i am not reffering to heroes stats here)?
All ideas i have here, nothing definitive :)
Если заклинания будут сильно влиять на игру как в 5 части , то думаю охота за заклинаниями очень даже хорошо впишется ,и заставит рисковать в этом смысле идти на риски
Some badass spells i'd like to see:
- Armageddon (fire)
- Chain lightning (air)
- Sacrifice (dark)
- Implosion (prime)
- Destroy undead (light)
- Earthquake (earth)
- Frost ring (water)
Don't forget Slow, Bless and Haste ;)
would rather see implosion as traditionally earth magic... as prime magic could be "stealth all spells"
Great suggestion! Chain lightning is my all time favorite too! :)
and some cool adventure map spells like dimention door, fly or mire :)
as a fan of H4 i'd like a hand of death spell)))
Don't forget the reanimate spells for the undead. I would really like to see those spells return. Those were really cool in H4. Like the raise skeleton and such.
So you're bringing back the magic guilds, eh? Excellent, Heroes of Might and Magic just wouldn't be right without the magic. I admit things look a little vague so far. But it is the early stages and I imagine things will become clearer as time goes by. Keep up the good work folks.
Yes it's a great thing to have mage guilds back, I don't miss at all the crap they made in H6 lol
I had ten friends playing with me heroes V multiplayer and then of heroes VI bulshits only I am left!
What will be the next article?
"Heroes can move from point A to point B. Some heroes can learn specific skills to improve their movement range...blah blah"
How long are we going to be bombarded with obvious and irrelevant articles?
I believe this is pointed towards those who haven't even played Heroes games, or those that have just started.
But yeah, they should release a better article next time.
Pity they don't show something for fans of Heroes series ... something about 90% of people on this page :-)
Friday will be really cool!
Vote on the eye color of swordmasters!!
we get one month before an elimination round
Damn it...edit button T_T
*Pity they will not show anything for fans...
i lol'd hard!
here you go haven town screen, please keep in mind that it is "work in progress" but its the same town screen since the first day. but please keep in mind that it is "work in progress." we didnt changed it a bit and we wont. but still dont blame us aaaah what is it here? a new article about magic guilds which says exactly nothing new, we said all of that at the twitch stream. talk about it, forget haven ts now. shhhhh...!
It would be great if each faction specializes in teaching one school of magic. For example:
Haven: Light Magic
Sylvan: Earth Magic & Water Magic
Inferno: Fire Magic
Necropolis: Dark Magic
Dungeon: Prime Magic
Fortress: Air Magic & Runes
Stronghold: War Cries
Academy: Master of all magic
I agree with you
Well, isn't it what they mean by :
Most factions have preferred magic schools and also refuse to teach certain magic schools in their towns. That’s why, for instance, a Haven magic guild will never teach Dark magic spells, but will always teach at least one Light magic spell for each level of the guild.
I do not agree.
because for now magic school were never well balanced.
H3 : only earth/air magick were usefull.
H4 : haos magick were useless in late game, deat usefull only because of necromancy.
H5 : do somone realy use sumonnig or dark magick?
H6 : well magik heroes in H6....
that not too bad if magic scool are not realy balanced, if it do not affect faction balance.
This is much better, already more fun then heroes 6.
I have question unrelated to the topic.
When will be the infamous 'update' ???
I mean it is more than a month since the "Website Upcoming Update " because it was on 27th of November ! ;o
It feels great to have magic schools back also academy heroes seem to be the masters of magic as they should be. You have my +1 with magic guilds, now if you improve the towns screens too this game will truly have chance to be great :)
Sounds like a great system. Back to the roots with a few tweaks.
I'm all around excited.